Dr. Robert C. Orr has served as the Assistant Secretary-General for Policy Coordination and Strategic Planning in the Executive Office of the Secretary-General since 2004. His responsibilities include running the Secretary-General’s Policy Committee and serving as the principal policy advisor to the Secretary-General on climate change, energy, food security, global health and counter-terrorism.

Dr. Orr joined the United Nations from Harvard University where he served as the Executive Director of the Belfer Center for Science and International Affairs at the Kennedy School of Government. Prior to this, he served as Director of the Council on Foreign Relations in Washington, D.C.

From 1996 to 2001, Dr. Orr served in senior posts in the Government of the United States, including Deputy to the U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations and Director of the USUN Washington office, where he was instrumental in securing an agreement to have the United States pay its arrears to the United Nations. He also served as Director of Global and Multilateral Affairs at the National Security Council, where he was responsible for peacekeeping and humanitarian affairs.

Dr. Orr has published extensively on post-conflict reconstruction, the United Nations, peacekeeping, and democracy promotion. His publications include Winning the Peace: an American Strategy for Post-Conflict Reconstruction (CSIS Press, 2004) and Keeping the Peace: Multidimensional UN Operations in Cambodia and El Salvador (Cambridge University Press, 1997).

Dr. Orr received his Ph.D. and M.P.A. in International Relations from the Woodrow Wilson School at Princeton University, and his bachelor’s degree from the University of California Los Angeles (UCLA). He speaks Spanish and Mandarin. Dr. Orr is married and has two children.

Season Preview: The United Nations and Korean Leadership

Thursday, January 17, 2013

SPEAKER:

Robert C. Orr
Assistant Secretary General for Policy Coordination and Strategic Planning, Executive Office of the Secretary General, United Nations

Moderated by
Dr. Stephen NoerperSenior Vice President, The Korea Society

STEPHEN NOERPER: (Moderator):
Welcome to The Korea Society and welcome to Studio Korea. I'm Senior Vice President Stephen Noerper. Our guest is Dr. Robert Orr, Assistant Secretary General for Policy Coordination and Strategic Planning, here today to talk about the United Nations and Korean leadership. Dr. Orr has had a long and distinguished record, joining the United Nations in 2004. Prior, he served at the Belfer Center at Harvard University. He directed the Washington office of the Council on Foreign Relations and served with the United States government in senior advisory positions. Dr. Orr, welcome to The Korea Society. We're absolutely delighted to have you here.

ROBERT ORR:
It's a pleasure to be here.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
You are in a very unique position. You advise the Secretary General on policy and have the opportunity to coordinate his policy group. As His Excellency Ban Ki-Moon is Korean-born, we're very keen on hearing your thoughts as to his initial term and hopes for his second term.

ROBERT ORR:
Well, if you review the job description of Secretary General to the UN, it does not come with the same authorities as a president or prime minister in terms of line responsibilities, deep bureaucracies, or generous financial pockets. What the Secretary General has is the unique power to convene, to mobilize, and to be a moral authority, not just for governments, but for people around the world behind a common agenda. I believe that is how Secretary General Ban has used that platform—in some ways very consistent with his predecessors or previous secretaries-general, and in some very new ways. I think there is definitely a Korean thread to this story.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
Interesting. Could you expand on that?

ROBERT ORR:
Well, as the shift of power turns toward Asia, you have a Secretary General who is not only very sensitive to that, but who has lived as a recipient of many UN services in a uniquely Korean way. As a boy growing up, Secretary General Ban not only saw but experienced many of the UN programs—not just those related to peace and security in relation to the Korean War, but also programs devoted to development and human rights. He knows what it is like to consume UN services, and he's the first Secretary General to have done so. The extraordinary rise of Korea, along with the imminent responsibilities that Asia and East Asia will have playing leadership roles, has made him conscious that the twenty-first century UN will need to look very different from the twentieth-century UN.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
His Excellency's first term is marked with such efforts as strong pronouncements on Libya. Is there a takeaway moment for you from his first term as Secretary General?

ROBERT ORR:
There are a few takeaway moments. I think his "responsibility to protect" message to Libya was extremely important; in part because many did not expect a Korean Secretary General to weigh in on such issues. He, in fact, campaigned on these issues (and I believe very boldly so) before he became Secretary General, and it shouldn't have been a surprise to anyone that once he took on that role he emphasized these issues—marrying principles with power to make sure those principles were observed. In the case of Libya, this was the first time the Security Council invoked the "responsibility to protect," and it was extremely important that the Secretary General took the lead on that in order to create the space for the Security Council to make those decisions.

There are other takeaway moments from the first term—surprises for some and expected by others. The Secretary General led on climate change from day one in office, and this is very striking given the economic rise of Asia and its interaction with economic, environmental and climate-related prospects. He brought with him relationships and sensibilities from Asia, and they have been extremely important in driving the global climate change discussion forward.

His rescue of the climate negotiations in Bali, and then again in Copenhagen, were really quite bold in that no Secretary General is commissioned to engage in member state negotiations. In both cases, he had earned the credibility such that when negotiations broke down, he was the one they turned to, to get them back on track. In very different spheres, his personal leadership and his style have made a difference.

Moreover, Secretary General Ban was able to make a big difference in the Myanmar/Burma situation. As you might remember, he was greatly criticized at that time for becoming involved with the Myanmar government. By accessing international agencies to help the people of Myanmar with the disaster of Cyclone Nargis (for which there was some serious resistance within the country and the regime), His Excellency was able to engage with the government.

Further, he was able to hold a pledging conference for Myanmar in Myanmar—the first time anything like that had ever happened. I dare say if he had not been Secretary General of the UN, that would not have occurred. I think a lot of the quiet diplomacy around the transition in Myanmar is due to the efforts of Secretary General Ban. It's a story that may be told in full some day. His [prior] Korean engagement with Myanmar and having lived through what he lived through in Korea certainly made a difference.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
...as Auden wrote, "an affirming flame" and certainly a wonderful takeaway. Looking forward to the remainder of Secretary General Ban's second term, what opportunities and challenges do you anticipate?

ROBERT ORR:
Let me start with the challenges. We are at a moment in time where state capacity around the world is under great strain. Treasuries are empty (or certainly much emptier than they are used to being). Governments that have traditionally supported the UN and the international system (particularly Europe and the United States) are in more difficult positions, and some of the faster-growing governments are not the ones that carried the bulk of financial or political responsibilities for the international architecture of the UN—those being the World Bank/Bretton Woods institutions. There is a mismatch between the reality of 2013 and the older structures formally supported by those parts of the world that are now most affected by the economic crisis. So, from a budgetary standpoint, it's very challenging right now for a number of governments, and these challenges directly pass through the UN. The Secretary General, almost on a daily basis, talks about "doing more with less."

Shifting to the opportunity side, the need for global collaboration has never been greater, in part because of the economic situation. In addition, with the Arab Spring and the shifting of the balance of power in the world, the need for international solutions has never been greater. That means that the kinds of problems that land on the UN's doorstep may be similar to problems of previous decades, but never has the volume been as great as it is now. So, there are both opportunities and challenges with the overwhelming number of issues coming to the UN.

As to green growth or sustainable development (depending on the terminology you wish to use) that set of issues is a challenge, but more so an opportunity. We have to restructure our economies to obtain prosperity, but do so in a sustainable way; at national, regional and international levels. We are experiencing a significant shift requiring the reorganization of both our economies and our societies. You can't do that absent crisis; and we indeed have a crisis. The international private sector is restructuring itself in many ways. Governments tend to be slower than the private sector at accomplishing that. We are at that moment in time where we can turn the ship in a new direction.

I think the kind of discussion we've had at the UN around sustainable development and climate change points to a new path we can take. Being at the forefront of these types of changes is something the UN has never been through before, even up to a few years ago. Now that Secretary General Ban has pointed the ship in that direction, countries and institutions are following. We have very exciting years in front of us.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
Korea now has one of the rotating seats on the United Nations Security Council. As of February 1, it takes over the presidency of the Council. Do you have any thoughts as to how Korea might use its role in the presidency, as well as its role in the Security Council the next two years?

ROBERT ORR:
Very robustly, I expect. I believe that Korea is definitely coming into its own on the international stage. It is a process that takes time; but with each passing year, the Korean leadership is maturing, and that is obvious in several different arenas. Korea has stepped up its engagement on some of the green growth and climate issues. I expect we'll see more from Korea during its tenure on the Security Council, particularly on the peace and security side. Being on the Council helps to gain the world's attention.

The Republic of Korea now fills a very important space, not just in the UN, but in the international community at large. For several years, it has been neither fish nor fowl. It has been neither a client nor a traditional donor. It is not the United States, and it is not a European power. Korea can do things that many other countries might not be able to do on the Security Council. It can lead coalitions around new issues. In specific crisis situations, its profile may be more appealing to parties involved in a conflict than that of traditional powers (with their own styles of engagement in diplomacy and leadership). On which issues will Korea choose to focus? I can't tell you at this point. We'll have to wait and see. I would make a pretty strong prediction that we will see an active and assertive Korea on the Security Council.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
To what degree, Secretary Orr, do you foresee an elevation of Peninsular issues on the agenda? Though when one has the presidency (just as when one is the Secretary General), the focus is global, Korea has the last vestige of the Cold War, with potential conflict always at hand. In addition, Navi Pillay, UN High Commissioner for Human Rights, is vigorously encouraging an international inquiry into human rights abuses by the North Korean government. Could that be an issue that the Koreans bring forward on the Security Council agenda?

ROBERT ORR:
The issues surrounding the Peninsula are many, and they're handled in different fora. Obviously, the nuclear issues are handled in a certain way, the humanitarian and human rights issues are handled in a different way, and then there are the geopolitical issues. One of the challenges is making sure that there is coherence across all of those different axes of discussion on Peninsular issues. The UN has played a very important role at various stages of engagement, using its institutions creatively and effectively to engage with the DPRK. At times, the UN has been the last lifeline for a very large swath of the population in North Korea.

The issues that the High Commissioner for Human Rights raised are not new. The human rights concerns in the DPRK are many, and they've been around for some time. There is always ongoing discussion about such issues as human rights, peace, and security. Dr. Pillay's elevated appeal for review of the DPRK's abuse of human rights along with the nuclear file reminds us that we can't forget these issues. They're absolutely crucial.

The people in the DPRK deserve to have their rights respected just like any person does anywhere in the world under the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. There are some specific and unique challenges in the North, and attention to these issues is good. I think everyone will have to work hard to make sure that something concrete comes out of the discussion, and that it doesn't become a dialogue of the deaf.

As you said, sitting on the Council does not equate to more action on the security side of a given issue. It does, however, import into the Council a certain level of expertise and interest in the issue. In the end, it is all about how Korea not only plays that, but how all of the other major partners in the dialogue decide to pursue it. The Council has had relative success, as well as frustrations, on matters relative to the DPRK over the years. I don't believe there's any one thing that guarantees either success or failure in addressing some of the Peninsular issues while the ROK is on the Council; but the likelihood for them to gain more attention is very probable.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
Interestingly Korea will have a second term at the presidency during its two-year tenure.

ROBERT ORR:
That is quite unusual. The five permanent powers are usually the ones that get used to being president, and this really is an interesting and important opportunity for Korea to demonstrate leadership. Having two bites at the apple, so to speak, gives Korea a bit of time to plan its agenda and stage it in such a way that it won't have to jam it all into next month when it is in the Chair at the Security Council.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
Secretary Orr, you mentioned green climate issues. The Green Climate Fund [gcfund.net] will be located in Songdo, Incheon. During her candidacy, ROK President-elect Park Geun-hye spoke very positively about the benefits of the fund being sited at Songdo, Incheon along with the possibility of other international organizations being sited around Korea in the future. With South Korea now a hub in Northeast Asia, what do you think about the Green Climate Fund's potential?

ROBERT ORR:
It's a very important development for Korea. The competition to host the Green Climate Fund was really quite intense. I believe there are a couple of reasons why Korea ended up with the winning bid. First, it was a very strong bid technically and included all the variables one looks for from a hosting arrangement. Songdo, Incheon really did it’s homework, and the Korean government supported it strongly.

It also is a testament to the way people see Korea today: as a source of innovation and as a country that has combined, each passing year, its attention on growth and prosperity along with a focus on sustainability issues and green growth. Many were betting on Korea to win—that this is the right kind of place to host a fund that is going to be a hub financing transformative types of activities. It was a very interesting choice, obviously. It's not just Korea, and it's not just Seoul. It's Songdo, Incheon. It's a very new-looking place.

What happens with the Green Climate Fund is not a foregone conclusion, but will be a function of the negotiations. Will we have a successful, conclusive, global agreement by 2015, as the governments have agreed? Do they have a clear vision of the financing vehicles, and what we need from each of those vehicles? Is there a clear division of labor between those channels? What will the Green Climate Fund do? What will the World Bank do? What will the UN system do? There is a long list of institutions that fund in this space. At the end of the negotiations, I think it's safe to say that we are not going to see all the money needed for climate financing travel through a single channel, but through multiple channels. Again, within that, is there a clear vision for what the Green Climate Fund will do?

I think having it in Korea helps differentiate it in another way. It's not in Washington, D.C. with the Bretton Woods institutions. It's not in one of the traditional financial capitals of the world. It will have to be different than other instruments, just by the fact that it is being sited in Korea, and I think that's probably healthy. I believe it's no accident that it's located in Asia either. Asia will be required to contribute significantly to this fund and will probably be one of the biggest beneficiaries of the fund.

So, with the center of gravity being in Asia, this institution will be required to bear a fair share of the weight. Some of it will depend on where the negotiations go, and whether the countries that will ultimately need to vote shares actually put money in the fund—that they agree this institution is the right channel through which the money should pass. There's still quite a bit of work to be done. The early steps have been very positive, and Korea has positioned itself well. We will need to see some decisive movements to fill that fund within the next year or two, so that is not an empty shell.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
It sounds as if the Green Climate Fund has the markings of a twenty-first century type of organization. In terms of institution-building, does Korea’s playing a leadership role here allow more familiarity with processes that one day may assist it in terms of it’s integration, whether by sudden collapse [of the DPRK] or by integration over time? Certainly, the demands on a Korean Peninsula integrating will be immense and require a great deal of international support. Will Korea's new leadership roles help prepare it for that eventuality?

ROBERT ORR:
That is a brilliant question, actually. The assumed, traditional logic of integration in Peninsular issues is that things will get sorted out, and that the international community will help support that process. The German experience of integration taught us that the burden of integration is actually quite heavy.

While Korea is a very different animal and has its own unique challenges with integration, the fact is that most of it has to come from inside. That's skill sets. That's orientations. That's institutions. I think your question is a good one because the ROK is currently accumulating a new range of necessary skill sets. It is gaining a great deal of experience with humanitarian, stabilization, and institution-building issues that could be applied much closer to home than where they currently are with their tenure on the Security Council.

There's never a one-for-one transfer of experience from one place to another. Rather than segregating Peninsular issues as unique, I believe there are things you can learn and apply from all of your experiences. Of course, there will be some things that are unique to the Korean Peninsula that no amount of experience somewhere else can replace. I think it will be an interesting blend when that time comes. I truly hope that the growth on the international stage that we've witnessed with Korea does, in fact, translate to the ultimate unification of the Peninsula in a smooth and effective manner.

STEPHEN NOERPER:
This has been a fascinating discussion, Dr. Orr. In closing, this is an important year for Korea. It marks the 60th anniversary of the end of the Korean War, the Armistice, and the first United Nations humanitarian action by way of refugee evacuation. We look forward to having you back, and we're very grateful to His Excellency Ban Ki-moon for his continued kindness and support of The Korea Society these last several years. You both now head to Davos. Assistant Secretary General Robert Orr, thank you for your time.

ROBERT ORR:
Thank you.

[End]